The most anticipated political interview of the year began low-key: with a lengthy diatribe about Oprah Winfrey. I remember the last few years of recording The apprenticeDonald Trump recalled how benevolent the talk show legend was towards him before his foray into politics.

Joe Rogan, the podcast heavyweight leading the conversation, was right about what came next. After Trump became a serious contender for the White House, there was “probably no one in history” who had been attacked in such a “coordinated” manner, he said. But Trump’s mere presence on the show suggested a new kind of cultural paradigm shift. He was once again placed centrally before America’s eyes and had the opportunity to explain almost everything.

What followed was a casual conversation with no intervention – there were no Kamala-esque, panicked aides demanding termination in the event of a stupid reaction, which is perhaps the main reason she didn’t appear on the podcast. Rogan expects his guests to sit for at least an hour, and Trump stays for three hours. It was three hours of coherent, continuous and typically hilarious entertainment. Seriously, it’s funny – when asked how he could have stopped Russia’s illegal invasion of Ukraine, Trump replied with the kind of low, theatrical growl you’d expect from him when he’s chastising a badly behaved jerk: “I told him, I said Vladimir, “you’re not going in”.

Trump was also capable of reflection, surprisingly poetic as he described his feelings as he entered the Lincoln Bedroom. He spoke fluently about the follies of Harris’ green energy plans (“Electric cars are powered by coal-fired power plants”), Biden’s disastrous military withdrawal from Afghanistan (“We left behind the best equipment in the world”) and his inspired approach to diplomacy with North Korea (“I I also have a red button, but mine is bigger than yours and mine works).

There were moments of awkwardness. Rogan seemed unfazed by Trump’s decidedly feeble attempts to convince him that he won the 2020 election. Two years ago, Rogan declined to invite the former president on the show, calling him an “existential threat to democracy.” But the first assassination attempt on Trump seemed to change his mind. For his part, Trump appeared extremely relaxed for a man who has suffered two attempts on his life in as many months, showing off his now-healed ear injury.

Trump ended the interview by reminding Rogan that he had a speech to give and that he would be happy to come back and speak again. A few hours later, he was back on the rally podium in Michigan and berated Kamala Harris for wasting time “campaigning” with celebrities. It’s safe to say that one can ignore the critics who claim that Trump has slowed down: perhaps a break is in order in 10 days after he is elected the 47th President of the United States.